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Talk:Leech

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2.0 leech mechanics

new 2.0 leech mechanics for later use on this page: http://www.reddit.com/r/pathofexile/comments/3a0818/cb_vitality_void_leech_cluster/cs99982

The Heading "Leech mechanics in The Awakening" is intended to replace the old "Mechanics" heading once it's more fleshed out. So it's not necessary to put any effort into the old one, or just remove it completely I've just left it there for ideas what to write about. I would focus more on the examples, what's holding me back is how to describe the difficulty in reaching leech cap against 1 enemy. I've done a calculator in Matlab because I'm more comfortable in that, it shows a plot of the leech rate and the total healed HP, but it's matlab and few can make use of that. Here is one in excel however this one is difficult to understand since it doesn't show leech rate variations in a plot: https://www.reddit.com/r/pathofexile/comments/3c1ljx/awakening_20_life_leech_calculator_and_discussion/ The ideal would be to get a excel sheet or a webpage that shows the leech rate variations in a plot. Illviljan (talk) 23:54, 23 July 2015 (UTC)

1. The grammar is broken in many places, with many singular/plural object/subject/verb mismatches. This looks like the result of recent rewriting of existing sentences. 2. Some of the writing is very awkward; it would be great if somebody with a writing background could take a pass at it. I would, but I don't think I actually understand the actual Leech mechanic, and I don't want to "correct" the existing exposition with factual errors. 3. There are some factual errors; Deidbell is listed as a unique item that grants "immunity to leech" to the player; if fact, Deidbell does the reverse. It prevents the player from leeching from the enemy, when the player is in a low life state. SonOfSmak (talk) 06:16, 26 August 2015 (UTC)

Factual errors

More factual errors pointed out by MarkGGG - https://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/1431325/page/1#p11773119 - If someone more comfortable than me in their knowledge of leech mechanics wants to fix the page go ahead, otherwise I'll give it a crack —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Futhead AvocadoCake (talkcontribs) 17:19, 1 October 2015 (UTC)

Change of approach

I changed a bit at the beginning of the mechanics section: Took out variables and rewrote some paragraphs for clarity. The Examples part still references the old format though. This is kinda fine because it briefly explains itself as it goes along, but if someone wants to update it to take out the variables that'd be great. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Sandborn (talkcontribs) 14:55, 9 April 2016‎ (UTC

I'll mention some negatives with this approach and why I don't prefer it:
  1. You can't easily copy/paste this for your own calculations.
  2. It's harder to maintain, since the page now mentions the same values multiple times on several places and may very well change in the future.
  3. Linked values from Character page was lost. Use {{#expr:{{SMW character query|stat=maximum_life_leech_rate_%_per_minute}}/60}}% when specifying the Expression error: Unrecognized punctuation character "[".% max leech rate.
  4. Where did 0.2, 0.02 come from? Is it an error? Is it from an earlier calculation? Is it out of date values, again? That's questions I would ask if I hadn't thought about this for so long and the explanations were hidden in the middle of the text. The symbols removes this hesitation, at least for me but maybe I'm too used to this way of thinking?
I am honestly most worried about the maintainability of the page. Since the mechanics changes quite often in this game it is important to make the text as generic as possible and only mention exact values as few times as possible. The Wiki have struggled with being up to date with the game and have gotten a bad rep for that and it's because using specific values everywhere that changes every new league.--Illviljan (talk) 17:37, 9 April 2016 (UTC)

Rewrite Guidelines

I'm drafting up essentially a rewrite of section 1 (Mechanics), but before I submit it or anything I want to clarify a few things:

  • Does this page need to explain how the mechanics changed from before 2.0.0 (The Awakening) to the current live version? Or could we just have a segment that outlines how it used to work before The Awakening somewhere else on the page? It's kind of trivia at this point.
  • Does the examples section need to be preserved? And if so, can I rewrite some of it? The first few examples strike me as overly abstracted.

--Softspoken (talk) 01:53, 4 September 2016 (UTC)

Just move the pre-awakening notes to a Version history at the bottom. The examples were intended to show the maximum leech cap and the if/else nature of it. I wanted to make a example to show that it takes a while to get to max leech rate as well, but those required graphs in my opinion and those are harder to maintain. But GGG seems to have settled on these values. Also, use {{Math}} for the formulas.--Illviljan (talk) 06:29, 4 September 2016 (UTC)
So I changed the page. Somethings that I would probably want to improve - Is there a SMW Character Query for the default rate at which a leech heal is applied? (Currently 2% of relevant pool) That way I could future proof some of the references to 2% of maximum health. I also used #% increased (or reduced) Life Leeched per second and the like pretty liberally, so my apologies if it's too much blue text. --Softspoken (talk) 00:00, 28 September 2016 (UTC)
Max leech per second is 20%, and yes, there is smw for it, it's even an example at Template:SMW character query. — TheFrz — 00:17, 28 September 2016 (UTC)
Yes, that one exists but not the base leech per second which is by default 2% per leech instance. There's no property for it at the moment. You CAN do {{#expr:{{SMW character query|stat=maximum_life_leech_rate_%_per_minute}}/(60*10)}}% but I'm not sure if that's how it's actually implemented as and it might just be misleading and harder to edit in the end. I think basic text is the best for now. --Illviljan (talk) 07:40, 28 September 2016 (UTC)

Leech enchantement on boots

Hello,
would it make sense to add the boot enchantments to an extra section of the main page?

EnchantmentLifeAndManaLeechOnKill1 53 0.4% of Damage Leeched as Life and Mana if you've Killed Recently
EnchantmentLifeAndManaLeechOnKill2_ 66 0.5% of Damage Leeched as Life and Mana if you've Killed Recently
EnchantmentLifeAndManaLeechOnKill3 75 0.6% of Damage Leeched as Life and Mana if you've Killed Recently

List of boot enchantment mods

--KaiIlu (talk) 17:10, 14 November 2016 (UTC)

That's fine. Go ahead. —Vini (t|c) 01:46, 15 November 2016 (UTC)

SMW rework

I'm trying to get equivalent of the list:

using SMW.

{{#ask:
 [[Concept:Unique items]]
 [[Is drop enabled::True]]
 [[Has explicit stat text::~*Enemies Cannot Leech*]]
 |?Has name
 |?Has inventory icon
 |?Has infobox HTML
 |link=none
 |format=template
 |template=SMW item table/ul/basic/row
 |named args=yes
}}

return nothing. while:

{{#ask:
 [[Concept:Unique items]]
 [[Is drop enabled::True]]
 [[Has explicit stat text::~*Leech*]]
 |?Has name
 |?Has inventory icon
 |?Has infobox HTML
 |link=none
 |format=template
 |template=SMW item table/ul/basic/row
 |named args=yes
}}

yields: {{#ask:

Concept:Unique items
Is drop enabled::True
Has explicit stat text::~*Leech*
|?Has name
|?Has inventory icon
|?Has infobox HTML
|link=none
|format=template
|template=SMW item table/ul/basic/row
|named args=yes

}} I see no logic in this.
What am I doing wrong? Is there a better way to make bulleted list of unique items picked by specific explicit text? —0xF  17:52, 15 November 2016 (UTC)

The first query doesn't work because stat texts have links inside of them, so if you want to query this way it should be like ~*Enemies*Cannot*Leech*, but it's not a good idea to query by stat text because it can change anytime while internal ids are quite stable. Also I believe we try to reduce the amount of raw ask queries for a few reasons by replacing them with templates. In this case you should use {{SMW item table}} with a custom column, see examples. — TheFrz — 18:32, 15 November 2016 (UTC)
There's also a annoying limit to how many symbols the query searches through and since Has explicit stat text often becomes rather large this becomes a real issue. --Illviljan (talk) 18:55, 15 November 2016 (UTC)